MONTHLY
FOIBLES
...wherein
we discuss what did and didn’t work for us this month…
Moss
- I once again tried to do my monthly review on Manjaro. I’d gladly
do Endeavour OS but Tony has already done that, so I wanted to hear
from the other side of the Arch-can-be-easy camp. Once again, I had
the issue of upgrades downloading and then the system freezes, and
when I rebooted (maybe a re-login would suffice) and started the
updates again, it found the downloaded files and installed them. It
also does this for any files I choose to install from the software
center or AUR. So, no Manjaro this month. A few users in our Telegram
group tried to replicate this issue and failed, although I’m pretty
sure they were only using a VM, so I will try again for Episode 009
with a new download.
Our
friend Tony Hughes blessed me with a Raspberry Pi 3B in a Pimoroni
clear case, via Goerge Doscher of Tech + Coffee. I got around to
plugging it in, using HDMI-1 on my TV while my Galago Pro 2 is
plugged in (and was running at the time) on HDMI-3. The Pi looked
lovely (using Raspbian on a card I was using on my Pi 2B+), and then
I flipped the TV over to HDMI-3, and my Mint was about 20%
overscanning my TV monitor, making it almost useless. I managed to
lower the resolution and make it work, with admittedly larger icons
and such. I later found that it also affected my Bodhi installation,
but not my other installations; the only common thread is that Bodhi
and Mint are based on 18.04 LTS Ubuntu, whereas the other distros I
currently have are based on later versions of Ubuntu or Debian. I
moved my laptop HDMI cable to HDMI-2 and everything worked again. The
guys in our Telegram group encouraged me to try the experiment again
but I chose to leave things as they lay.
Listener
Dale Miracle gifted me with a bit of money and a new M570 Logitech
trackball to take with me on my daily sojourns with the Kudu 3 while
testing distros for this show. Thank you, Dale.
I
have added another partition on the Galago Pro 2, and installed
Sabayon on it. That makes 6 distros on this machine, one of which is
Debian, 4 of which are Ubuntu/Mint, and one Gentoo, with a wide
variety of desktops although both Mint and Sabayon are using MATE.
I
still have the T430 for sale on eBay, and for some reason have been
having trouble getting around to posting the IdeaPad 110 there.
Tony
This
last month has been a round of family funerals so while I have been
doing my hopping challenge for the month I’ve probably not been as
conscientious of keeping notes as I could have been, that being said
I am back at my linux roots with Ubuntu, but more of that later.
As
for other things I’ve been getting into my new hobby of collecting
and restoring old Diecast model cars, particularly Matchbox models of
the 1960’s and early 70’s. Although I have managed to pick up
some earlier models from the 1950’s including the model that kicked
it all off, the Coronation
Coach
that
Lesney produced in 1953 and sold a million, which just after World
War 2, was an astonishing thing, rationing didn’t fully end in
Britain until the following year.
Over
the last few weeks I have been ‘Investing’ in a number of these
models, some of which need a restoration and some which are good
enough to leave in their 50-60 year old play worn state.
On
a side note, while sorting some of my late father's belongings 2-3
years ago, I found some petrol ration coupons that were never used,
as rationing had ended before they were due to be cashed in.
I
was asked by a Friend to upgrade her daughters laptop to Windows 10
from W7 and install an SSD at the same time, AND Dual boot it with
Linux Mint 19.2 Mate, and last week I was finally able to get around
to doing it.
Considering
it’s a few years since Microsoft supposedly stopped the free
upgrade path from W7/8 I found I was still able to do it. After
getting W10 upgraded and showing as activated, I swapped out the
500Gb Spinner for a 250Gb SSD, did a clean install of W10, which as
It had previously been activated on that PC, was not a problem, I
then did the Linux install. As you may figure the Linux side was
flawless but the Windows 10 update broke Windows, luckily I was able
to do a system restore to a point before the update and get it
working again. I found out that the November update last week has
been very problematic. So If you do need to run a Windows system (and
I know many Linux users do, or support someone who does), steer clear
of the update manager for a week or so until Microsoft have admitted
there is a problem and fixed it.
When
I was handing back the laptop I was speaking to Paula, and she
doesn’t want to use the new subscription service for MS Office so
was planning to keep a Win7 install, she doesn’t do anything
complex with macros in office or excel but does need to send
completed documents to other people and was worried about formatting
going wrong. We had a discussion about converting documents to PDF
format with LibreOffice and emailing these so she would be sure that
they arrive exactly as she created them. She home teaches and has to
send the children’s work to external validators, so this also saves
in having to print them off, so she can scan them to PDF before
emailing. So another case for open source software for the win.
I
do like it when you can give people solutions to problems that were
so simple to fix
UPDATES
(Where
we discuss what we have learned about distros we’ve already
reviewed)
Moss
- I did a quickie review of Pearl Desktop 8 at Sourceforge.com. Pearl
is getting a few downloads (“147 this week” 11/17). My review is
the only review of PD8 to date, although I didn’t check earlier
versions.
I
have noticed the more I use Q4OS, Trinity Desktop just doesn’t work
for a lot of things, mostly KDE apps I use, which makes it not
effective for their intended purpose marketing to businesses. I think
they need to redo their marketing and stop pushing the Win XP aspect
of Trinity Desktop, this is as fine a Debian distro as any. But
I’m still using Q4OS with Plasma desktop; this makes it the only
Plasma on my system, and also the only pure Debian on my system. I
hear a lot of people complain about the Debian installer, but Q4OS
has a simple installer, looks like Ubiquity. So if you want Debian
Buster, and you like Plasma, then you simply should be using Q4OS. If
you prefer XFCE, then your easy choice is MX Linux.
Tony
- Nothing from me this week, as I said, it's been a strange month and
to be honest, keeping track of the Linux world has been the last
thing on my mind.
Tony - DISTRO NAME: Ubuntu 19.10
INSTALLATION
So
for information this month's installation was again done as a sole
install on my Toshiba Portege Z30 the specification is as follows,
this is the same machine I used for last month's EndeavourOS review:
Intel® Core™ i5-4210U CPU 2cores and 4 threads @ 1.70GHz to 2.7GHz
128Gb M2 SSD and 8Gb DDR3 Ram.
This
is the last test for the time being on this PC, I'll be changing
hardware for the next review.
As
you would expect with Ubuntu the installer is very easy to navigate,
on booting into the live image you get the option to try before you
buy, or just jump straight into the installation. If you boot into
the live environment you are presented with the Gnome 3 DE, with a
Dock down the left hand side of the screen and 3 icons on the
desktop. A folder marked Ubuntu which takes you to the file manager,
the trash bin and an Icon to install. I jumped straight into the
installer. On opening the installer you get the usual options to
choose your language and set a keyboard layout, after this you have
the first real decision to make, Normal or minimal installation, as I
was using this machine for a month I wanted all the normal software
so opted for the normal installation. I also chose to install the
updates and third party software during the install, this installs
any proprietary software for drivers and Audio and Video codecs you
need for things tp work after the installation is completed.
The
next screen gives the option to do a complete install, wiping the
HDD/SSD, or install alongside of the current OS, I went for the nuke
and boot option. You also get the option to use the ZFS, I chose to
stick with the default ext4. Press continue and you get the warning
about losing all data, and asking do you wish to continue. I said yes
and this starts the process of setting up your location, user name,
password and if you wish to login automatically or require the
password, whatever you choose, this can be changed later if required.
While
your doing this, the install is going ahead in the background so it
was only a few minutes later and I was being prompted to reboot into
the new system. I duly did this and was presented with the Gnome 3 DE
in all its glory. Now listeners of this show will know I am not a fan
of the Gnome 3/Unity style of DE so this is where the fun begins.
POST
INSTALLATION HARDWARE FACTS & ISSUES
After
first boot Neofetch reports 780Mb of 8G Ram being used and Top is
reporting about the same. Although in a Virtual PC memory usage was
nearly 1Gb which is not what I was expecting, as my previous
experience has been that this is normally lower than on real
hardware. So I’m not sure what is going on there. Gparted
reports the the system at first install before adding any additional
software uses just under 7Gb of Disc space. which makes using a
smaller SSD an option if you are not going to use the PC for storing
large files on the local drive.
As
for hardware everything was working as I would expect so no issues
there.
EASE
OF USE
My
first gripe with Gnome 3 is the Desktop layout which after 30 years
of using PC’s with a taskbar/panel at the bottom of the screen and
menu to the left side of that is not too my particular taste. Luckily
for me there are solutions for this so using Gnome Tweak, Dash to
Dock and Dash to panel and the ARK menu (Thank you Peter Jones, from
the Telegram channel and the BDLL community). I was eventually able
to get the desktop to look somewhat familiar to me. After that it is
a breeze to use Ubuntu. I honestly do not understand the reason Gnome
decided to move to this style of desktop when Gnome 3 was released.
You can use all the modern tool sets and retain the traditional
bottom panel and menu layout without reinventing everything and
getting everyone to learn a new way to do everything, Cinnamon has
proved that very well.
APPLICATION
ISSUES:
Anyway
back to Ubuntu 19.10, everything works, there are a few things that
Canonical no longer install on Ubuntu as part of the iso, synaptic,
and GIMP being 2 that are used by me on a regular basis, but they are
only an apt install away, as are all the other software tools I use
regularly, so no issues in that department. Also if there was
something not in the regular repos you have Snap and after
installation Flatpak that you can fall back on to for other things,
or getting the latest package of something not yet updated in the
repos.
MEMORY
USE:
As
I said earlier, memory at first boot is below 800Mb on the hardware
tested and even with several applications in use at the same time I
never came close to maxing out the 8Gb installed on this PC.
EASE
OF FINDING HELP
Because
Ubuntu or its derivatives are the predominant Linux in use around the
globe there is no shortage of people or places to get help. As I said
Peter Jones from the mintCast telegram channel helped me to get the
DE to look and feel more like I am used to and was very patient with
me in doing so, and if all else fails I can always call on Popey for
a little advice as he is in several of the social media channels
related to Ubuntu. Seriously the community around Ubuntu and Linux in
general has dramatically improved over the 12 years that I have used
Linux. Yes you still get the occasional rtfm from a few zealots, but
on the whole most folk are very helpful and more importantly patient
with me when I get frustrated that I can not get it to work.
PLAYS
NICE WITH OTHERS
Ubuntu
plays very well with other OS’s personally I’ve never had any
issues with installing Ubuntu alongside any other OS or as a multi
boot system.
STABILITY
Rock
solid, which given this is a point release in preparation for
20.04LTS so there will be a few things that are still being tested
out, and a few bugs to iron out, I have had no issues while using
19.10 that are not cosmetic in relation to the DE. This bodes well
for the LTS when it arrives in April next year.
RATINGS:
Ease
of Installation new user friendly install score 10/10
experienced
Linux users 10/10
Hardware
Issues 10/10
Ease
of Finding Help (Community, Web) 10/10
Ease
of Use 8/10
Plays
Nice With Others 10/10
Stability 10/10
Overall Rating 9/10
SIMILAR
DISTROS TO CHECK OUT
Linux
Mint
All
the Ubuntu spins (Xubuntu etc)
Pop
OS (I’ve not tried it but hearing great things about it)
FINAL COMMENTS
So
apart from my personal issues with Gnome 3 and the initial layout of
the DE, Ubuntu just works. I’ve probably said this many times but
it’s worth saying again. If it hadn’t been for Ubuntu I would
have probably not got into Linux when I did. What Mark (Shuttleworth)
has given to the World in the form of Ubuntu Linux is in my humble
opinion, one of the best things that has happened in the world of
technology in the 21st Century so far. No Ubuntu and over 90% of
today's Linux distributions would probably disappear, and with that
access to modern computing for a large part of the world who are
unable to afford modern PC’s and the ‘Windows Tax’. Although I
have moved to one of those derivative distributions, as I now use
Linux Mint for my production PC’s, this would not have been
possible without Ubuntu trail blazing a non geek Linux OS for us all
to benefit from.
Thanks
Mark.
(I can honestly say that I got quite emotional just writing that
paragraph for the show notes)
Moss’s
distro DISTRO
NAME:
Zorin
OS 15, Core and Ultimate
MY
HARDWARE:
I
run my test distros on a System76 Kudu 3, with 16 Gb RAM and a 500 Gb
hard drive, an i7 and Intel graphics chipset.
INSTALLATION
For
me, an installation includes the full installation and all updates.
If I can manage it, I then replace LibreOffice (if provided) with
SoftMaker Office, install my preferred VPN (currently Mullvad), and
set up Grub Customizer (if available) or other Grub management, and
then install my printer (Brother MFC-J491DW), a simple matter on .deb
and .rpm distros, not so much on others. I usually try to install
Stacer so that I can get good stats and a few extra controls.
Installation
was very Ubuntu-like with Ubiquity Installer. It took much less time
that I'm used to, and even the updates (after purging LibreOffice)
were snappy.
Then the fun started.
POST INSTALLATION HARDWARE ISSUES
I
got all my programs installed fine. But my clickpad could not
right-click; any click was treated as a left click. I used my
trackball and right-click worked fine. I could not move programs to
the taskbar, even though a few were already installed there.
I tried to join the Zorin forum to get some questions answered, and was told that my Protonmail address was not valid for use in their forum.
I was informed by members of the Telegram group that a two-finger touchpad use was the equivalent of a right-click, and even later that I could change the settings to enable the right-click on the clickpad, and that what most distros call a Taskbar, they call “Favourites”, and a right-click plus a left-click will get the program there. Just ask a KDE user what happens when you add a program to “Favourites” and you will know why I am confused by this.
So I have a system which looks like Win7, runs like Ubuntu, and, using the latest Gnome desktop with theming, does not allow for things which run easily in other desktops.
I get a red bar warning me against installing something when I attempt to install my packages. It does continue on if I tell it to. That might be a bit disturbing to some, but it does remind one of what should happen in Windows when you install something.
I got an extremely helpful and positive response from Zorin, including a free download link to Zorin OS Ultimate. For the record, Zorin did not ask anything of me for this free copy of Ultimate, and I’m sure you’ll be able to tell from my review they didn’t get anything they didn’t deserve. I am now testing both versions. They also fixed the bug which kept me from registering in the forum, so I have access. So far I have had nothing but friendly contacts in the forum.
Zorin’s
marketing says "you already know how to use this". I
didn't, and I'm a long-time Windows and (non-Gnome) Linux user. They
make it look
like
different versions of Windows, but that doesn't make it WORK
like
them. There are a TON
of
keyboard and touchpad shortcuts which come with Gnome and only Gnome.
So just because it looks like Windows doesn't mean it acts like it. I
really don’t find that this system is working that much like
Windows 7 or 10, any more than Linux Mint MATE or other Ubuntu
derivatives.
Zorin
Appearance locked up several times in Core, but I did not get the
same thing happening in Ultimate, and I did not take the time to
report it. There are 3 desktop choices in Core, 6 in Ultimate -- I
must have heard wrong on other shows, I thought that that were 6 in
Ultimate which were NOT found in Core, which were in addition to 2
found in Core.
I
have noticed that the Kudu3 is only getting 2-3 hours of running
time, where is was getting 3.5-4 hours last month. I thought Ubuntu
Gnome had worked on this issue already.
And
I returned from a time of looking at my phone to see a little popup
message stating that Automatic Suspend was about to commence due to
inactivity… I thought I had turned off all such power-saving
features. In the forum, other users have gotten the same message, and
there is no fix just yet, but I haven’t seen it other than that one
time.
EASE
OF USE
Well,
it’s actually easy to use. I really think my wife should be using
it instead of Linux Mint, no good reason just a feeling. But as I’ve
already said, it’s not as advertised, to be just like the Windows
you already know [paraphrased]. I am surprised that I’m using
this with so few issues, where it took me less than a week before I
wanted to blow Pop!_OS away. I am a lot more comfortable with this
than I have been with any other implementation of Gnome 3.
MEMORY
USE:
I
get different readings every time I look at Stacer. In Ultimate.
sometimes I’m only using 0.9 or 1.2 Gb of RAM, still not what
anyone would call “light”, and when I looked just before typing
this paragraph it was 4.7 Gb, with nothing open other than Firefox (4
tabs). Sometimes it’s good to have 16 Gb of RAM; if you only have 4
Gb you might find yourself swapping a lot. Zorin is using 16.9 Gb of
hard disk.
Booting
back into Core, with only Firefox (same 4 tabs) and Mullvad running,
I have 2.0 Gb of RAM in use and 27.3 Gb of hard disk in use, but that
includes Timeshift files for the Zorin Ultimate backups? With
FIrefox closed, it says 914.0 Mb RAM in use.
At
any rate, if you have sufficient RAM and disk space, this is
potentially a good system for you; if you don’t, it isn’t.
EASE
OF FINDING HELP
The
forum is moderated, so it could be a week or two before you get to a
trusted status and can just post directly to it. After that, the
users respond fairly rapidly and in a friendly manner. The forum does
not list the total number of users, but says the largest number on at
one time was 299, and there are nearly 52,000 posts to date. This
distro has been around nearly as long as Ubuntu itself, and should
have decent support at all times.
PLAYS
NICE WITH OTHERS
Not
tested. But it’s really just Ubuntu, so it should be fine.
STABILITY
The
only problem I had in locking up was while setting Zorin Appearance
in Core. I had no crashes. Again, it should be approximately as
stable as Ubuntu.
OTHER
VERSIONS
Zorin
has just recently come out with Zorin OS 15 Lite, featuring XFCE
Desktop. It looks a little heavy at first use, but after getting it
updated and rebooted it used just 505-520 Mb of RAM and around 8 Gb
of disk space. Their version of XFCE looks just like their
Zorin Gnome or even a MATE desktop, but you’ll find it works just
like the XFCE you expect. I find it is easier to log into at bootup,
but it was strange to note that selecting XFCE Terminal just gets you
a (rather involved) terminal setup screen; you have to select
Terminal Emulation to run a Terminal.
Zorin
also has an Education edition, with good programs for kids to learn
things on. I did not try this system.
SIMILAR
DISTROS TO CHECK OUT
Ubuntu
Fedora
Elementary
OS
anything
with Gnome desktop
RATINGS:
Ease
of Installation new user 8/10
experienced
user
9/10
Hardware
Issues 8/10
Ease
of Finding Help (Community, Web)
9/10
Ease
of Use
8/10
Plays
Nice With Others
8/10
Stability
9/10
Overall
Rating
8/10
FINAL
COMMENTS
This
is a really nice distro, probably the best version of a Gnome desktop
I’ve seen. My original thought was, “YOU LIED TO ME!”, because,
while it did look
like
Windows it didn’t work
like
Windows, which is what the marketing promised. Instead, it works just
like Ubuntu Gnome themed to look more like MATE. While there is
nothing wrong with that, it is also not compelling. I would select
this distro over Ubuntu Gnome, but Ubuntu Gnome is not at the top of
my list of what I’ve been recommending to new users. I will
state that the longer I worked on this review, the less strident the
review got.
I
have had close to zero actual problems with it. But after installing
Lite, I found myself working in that more, despite the fact that I
like XFCE barely more than Gnome - but just as with the way Zorin
spun Gnome for Core and Ultimate, Zorin Lite is the nicest XFCE spin
I’ve seen to date.
I
am reminded that you need to pay $39 to get Ultimate, and that gets
you a few more ways to arrange your desktop and a lot more
already-installed software. If you would be using this software, then
great. It’s all in the Software Center anyhow, so the only thing
you won’t get with Core is the extra desktop themes. Zorin does a
lot of work behind the scenes and feeds its updates, upgrades and
fixes upstream to Ubuntu. So if you like supporting Linux, then
acquiring a copy of Ultimate is a good way to show it.
NEW
RELEASES THIS MONTH:
from
our October 31 show to present
Endless
3.7.5
Container
2303.3.0
Tails
4.1
elementary
5.1
Sparky
2019.12
CAINE
11.0
Arch
2019.12.01
Archman
2019-12 "Xfce"
Ultimate
6.6 "Gamers MATE"
KDE
neon 20191128
Proxmox
6.1 "Mail"
Kali
2019.4
LibreElec
9.2.0
Volumio
2.671
Devuan
2.1
Absolute
20191125
Bluestar
5.3.12
KNOPPIX
8.6.1
SmartOS
20191121
Container
2247.7.0
Pardus
19.1
Clonezilla
2.6.5-1
Zorin
15 "Lite"
Endless
3.7.4
OSMC
2019.11-1
IPFire
2.23-core138
Debian-Edu
10.2.0
Debian
10.2.0
Oracle
8.1
Archman
2019-11
Bluestar
5.3.11
PCLinuxOS
2019.11
Void
20191109
Clonezilla
2.6.4-12
Manjaro
18.1.2 "Awesome"
batocera
5.24
NethServer
7.7
Red
Hat Enterprise Linux 8.1
Zentyal
Server 6.1
KaOS
2019.10
FEEDBACK
Greetings
from a Distrohopper listener
John
Wallis <essexdefender@gmail.com>
Hello
Tony, Hello Moss,
I
enjoy listening to your podcast (and also to the Mintcast).
Your distrohopping adventures have inspired me to do virtual
distrohopping. I have the following installed under VirtualBox:
Fedora
31 (successfully upgraded from the command line from Fedora 30)
SparkyLinux
6
Parrot
Linux
Solus
Budgie 4.0 Fortitude
ZorinOS
15 (which makes me feel like a henchman of Christopher Walken)
OpenSuSE
Ubuntu
Budgie 19.10
MX
Linux
My
Linux Mint build is 19.2 Cinnamon.
Kind
regards,
John
Wallis
Tony
replied:
Hi
John
Sorry
for the late reply but life's been life just recently.
Glad
to hear that you enjoy the show and you are distro hopping via
Virtualbox that's how I got started. Just be warned it's catching
before you know you'll be buying a second PC or dual booting to get
the real metal experience :-)
John
Wallis replied:
Hi
Tony,
Thank
you for your reply. While the idea of having an additional PC
just for physical testing of Linux distros would be great, I would
not be able to get a “business case” past my lovely wife,
although she is a happy Linux Mint user with me doing the maintenance
stuff for her!
I’m
going to recreate my ZorinOS virtual machine as it had run out of
space. Do you have any advice/ suggestions on what to remove
from the default installation to keep the size down? At present
LibreOffice is one of my candidates to remove before initial patching
of the virtual system.
One
thing that intrigues me - how did the Budgie desktop get its name?
My wife and I have budgies as pets, so the expression “Budgie
desktop” is amusing to us!
Of
the two Budgie desktops that I’ve tried out, I’m so impressed
with Solus Budgie that it would be my distro of choice if I were ever
to switching from having Linux Mint as my primary distro.
Kind
regards,
John
Tony
replied:
Hi
John
I
would remove anything that you don't use, LibreOffice
is a good one it takes quite a bit of space, but gimp, VLC,
etc are probably not going to be used in a VM. I think it's a case of
going through the software list and just uninstall anything you can
live without.
As
for an additional laptop it's coming up to present season what about
asking Santa 😂
ANNOUNCEMENTS:
We
are still hoping to produce a User-Only show, Distrohopper’s Digest
User Edition. We have posted the criteria to be used in your review
on the blog at https://distrohoppersdigest.blogspot.com.
We did not get any submissions in November.
Please
submit your review in .flac format if you can, but we can accept .mp3
if that’s the best you can do. Submitting a script of what was said
will also help our listeners, but is not required. Please send your
submission to distrohoppersdigest@gmail.com.
Moss
- My work here and at mintCast can be supported by joining my Sponsus
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or
by direct donation through Sponsus or PayPal
(zaivalananda@gmail.com)!
I am very grateful for all donations which have been or will be
received. Please tell me if you would like your name used on the
show, however you choose to donate.
Our
next show will be recorded on or about January 8, 2020. Visit our
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